Lost Data

[DuncanONeil]

I take exception to the statement that evolution and creation are mutually exclusive!!!!

As to that millisecond after the bang, That still leaves an awful lot of time unaccounted for.

That's misleading. Evolution is a fact. We know it happens.We see it all around us. There is no debate among mainstream scientists about this. The MECHANISMS of evolution are still being debated. Some have shown to be weak, others grow stronger. But these are simply our attempts at understanding a fact, just like gravity.

If you mean evolution and creationism, then no, they are not both correct. They are mutually exclusive.


If you want to believe that a supernatural being started it all by creating the universe and allowing life to evolve, that's all well and good, but you have to have evidence before you can present it as science. Otherwise it's faith, and has no place in the science classroom.


Science has shown that living cells can be produced by chemical reactions under the proper conditions. It has been shown that the entire universe can be explained, logically and consistently, without benefit of supernatural intervention, from approximately one millisecond (maybe less) after the Big Bang.

What we cannot explain (yet) is what happened before and at the precise moment of the Big Bang. What caused it? Where did the matter come from? Many other questions. If you wish to postulate a god of some kind initiating it, that's fine. There's no one to say you are wrong. But without evidence, you cannot claim you are right. You can only have faith.

[Thorne]

I take exception to the statement that evolution and creation are mutually exclusive!!!!
As to that millisecond after the bang, That still leaves an awful lot of time unaccounted for.

I said creationism, not creation, but your point is noted. I should have said "Biblical" Creation, or Genesis. It's quite possible that some kind of being began creation in that millisecond of time. As soon as you provide the evidence for it I'll be happy to adjust my belief system.

Just don't expect me to kneel down and sing his or her or its praises.

[DuncanONeil]

I said creationism, not creation, but your point is noted. I should have said "Biblical" Creation, or Genesis. It's quite possible that some kind of being began creation in that millisecond of time. As soon as you provide the evidence for it I'll be happy to adjust my belief system.

Just don't expect me to kneel down and sing his or her or its praises.

I still see no difference in the terms. Nor do I see any dicotomy in believing in both. For me the fact that you admit a possibility is actually sufficient.
Should there be a creator, even considering the Bible, we would have no concept of what a day constitutes for said being. Nor when they were satisfied with their work.

[Thorne]

I still see no difference in the terms. Nor do I see any dicotomy in believing in both. For me the fact that you admit a possibility is actually sufficient.
Should there be a creator, even considering the Bible, we would have no concept of what a day constitutes for said being. Nor when they were satisfied with their work.

Believing in it is one thing. Finding evidence for it is quite another. But regardless of how you want to define the biblical "day", the entire sequence of creation as shown in Genesis is wrong. Therefor impossible. After all, how can you have light on the first day but the sun, moon and stars on the fourth. And the earth coming before the sun? Um, I don't think that would work.

[DuncanONeil]

Believing in it is one thing. Finding evidence for it is quite another. But regardless of how you want to define the biblical "day", the entire sequence of creation as shown in Genesis is wrong. Therefor impossible. After all, how can you have light on the first day but the sun, moon and stars on the fourth. And the earth coming before the sun? Um, I don't think that would work.

Our ligt comes from the Sun, Now!

[Thorne]

Our ligt comes from the Sun, Now!

Great! So where did the light come from before the sun and stars were created? Just a generalized glow throughout the universe?

[MMI]

Great! So where did the light come from before the sun and stars were created? Just a generalized glow throughout the universe?

Actually, Thorne, that might be about right. After all, scientists talk about seeing traces of the Big Bang in background radiation, which is the same in every direction you look.

Of course, proof of the Big Bang would just about be the end for God.